This is not a "vetting"...

I noticed two loans in my group this morning, a D and an HR, neither of whom apparently have late-pays, chargeoffs, collections, or public records. The "HR" borrower does a good job of explaining her low grade -- she attributes it to high revolving utilization (maxing out cards) and a relatively new credit history (July 2001). Utilization can indeed kill a score, of course, because lenders justifiably worry about the solvency of someone who is depending upon their credit cards to make ends meet. The HR borrower's stated intention is to pay off the revolving credit, which will indeed raise her credit score and make her mortgage goal much more reachable.

Here are the two links, both worth a look:

Link to 18121

Link to 17999

Boilerplate TILA disclaimer: There is obvious risk alongside probable reward whenever one lends to someone they don't personally know, so these neutral mentions should be considered only within their limited contexts.

Need to fix your link to 17999... both links point to 18121.

Argh! Thanks! Corrected. :)

PsychDoc,

If you were able/willing to validate the "HR"'s income + offer letter... I'd bid a much larger amount. It looks like a good listing all around, not to mention a good social cause.

Agreed, I asked for the same thing in another thread.

I know you are buried Doc, keep up the good work.

Would it help if I posted a link to a scanned copy of my offer letter? I am willing to do this if it will help my loan get funded!

I'd appreciate this -- I'd prefer if you don't post it until after 5:30 EST tomorrow, though. :)

bad cd, very bad. :P

I also offered to validate a recent pay stub if Doc is too busy.

My sentiments exactly !!!

What's the joke that I'm missing? Should I post the offer letter or no? Also, Cusip are you offering to validate my offer letter paystub for real? I can email you those things if you are serious.

The joke is that they have funding coming into Prosper tomorrow at 5:30 EST, and that if the details are validated before then and look good, there is a chance the loan will fill up fast and they will not be able to bid it, due to lack of funds.

It's a good thing. :)

And yes, my offer was real, I sent you a PM.

Ooohhhhh...Ok. Gotcha. I will give the requested documentation to Cusip and once he validates it, everyone can bid to their hearts content!

Thanks People!

-Lauren

Here is a paystub for everyone to view. I could not show you the offer letter because that would go against my company's confidentiality policy.
I'm not sure why but that's what I was told by my boss.

Paystub

I'm not sure why this is so small. I resized it twice! Sorry.

if you're willing to fax them to me, pm me -- I can put up larger copies fairly easily.

http://prosperlenders.wikispaces.com/18121

(not 5:30 yet :) )

I came late to this thread but I wanted to give a heads up that one of Nocal's borrowers is having trouble verifying income with a letter of intent.

Why would the Check date be before the pay period?

...Gulp

It was a mess up with the payroll input (which I am now in charge of ) It's supposed to be 6/1/06. It'll be fixed on my next paystub but it looks crazy now. I was hired on the 18th of May and started working on the 25th of May. I got paid on the 1st of June. Sorry for the confusion!

PS- I'm not going to pretend those other pictures were not there (like the elephant in the room) and if any lenders want/need an explanation (it's really simple, nothing sordid or crazy) please PM me. Who ever did not see the pictures....sorry you missed them. They were awsome!

Ok, since a few have asked here are my thoughts.

While not able to get a lot of detail/confirmation on the work, the credit grade/details/rate alone is probably worthy with a bid. She has been upfront and responsive and I think the listing has merit for lenders who prefer the HR end of the spectrum.

I have bid it, and I believe it is likely to fund.

Great, now I'm wondering what the pics were.

Can you repost them? I feel like I'm missing out on something!

I'll bid on the loan even without them, though :)

jb

Ah, I put $200 down and didn't get to see the pics. Rats.

Wow.


Did I say wow?



Wow.

LOL. Sorry folks, the pictures are gone for good! They were awesome though...

Thanks for the bids!!!!

All I can say is the pictures were a work of art. :o Although completely irrelevant to the loan/listing.

:)

...Gulp

I did notice a couple of bids popped up after they were posted... ;)

The pictures were indeed great, but your loan is funding on its merits. :)

Should be complete in a few days!

Edit

Another troubling issue with 18121 is this:

"What do you mean "fake" income? Yes, he pays me cash and when I file my tax returns I don't put all that I make. Again, I know that's bad but I have been using the extra money to go to school. I only claim about $40,000 of the $60,000 I make on my tax returns. I don't think the $40,000 will qualify for a house around here even with my DF's $30,000. Houses are just way too expensive."


People, don't post your user name for another board if the other board is where you admit to tax fraud.

http://creditboards.com/forums/index.php?s...7&#entry1305967


IMO, there are a lot of strange issues related to this listing, and I doubt Prosper is going to accept a paystub from this borrower as proof of income.

More on 18121:

"I work for my dad in the computer repair/set-up/consulting business. He has what he pays me on his computer in his accounting software but he never gives me actual pay stubs because...well...I guess I never really thought I needed them, he's my dad after all (family business and all that). I guess he could make some up and print them out for me but I don't have W-2?s either. Again, I guess he could print some up for me.
I have not paid as much tax as I should because I don't claim all that I make.
My bank statements don't reflect steady deposits so they wouldn?t be very helpful in proving employment/income.
My dad has no problem signing anything saying I work for him and how much he pays me but since he is my dad, would we have some kind of conflict of interest or something?"




I wouldn't trust those paystubs that were posted, especially considering the date issue Big Gulp pointed out.


http://creditboards.com/forums/index.php?s...3&#entry1300653

Perhaps you missed that it is a one week paystub.

$1346 x 52 wks = approx $70k.

The thing that I find unusual about it, I mean besides the "check date" being wrong, is that this company's work week begins on Thursday and ends on Wednesday. I've never seen that before.

5/25/06 = Thursday
5/31/06 = Wednesday

Yes, my 5am math :)

But who receives a weekly paycheck at a $70k job?

That paystub is photoshopped, IMO. Especially considering the posts written on CB.

I have never seen a weekly paycheck for a $70k job, but I haven't yet seen everything, so while that is unusual, it doesn't knock me completely over, but when added to...

2. Work week beginning on Thursday just looks wrong.

3. Wrong check date. (She made an excuse, I know, but you get points for every error, even if it comes with an excuse.)

4. I failed at my attempt to verify the existance of the company L H Consult. Not in google. Doesn't come up in bbb.org. Companies with letters in their name are always tricky when doing searches, but I tried and I failed.

5. Creditboards posts about not reporting income, etc.

I don't plan to bid.

This thread is absolutely disturbing:

http://creditboards.com/forums/index.php?s...28&#entry782728


"Like, say you don't have the tax forms.....have you ever just made some up for the sake of the verification? Would the bank check with the IRS? Because I have Turbo Tax and well it would be real easy to....well you know"



I hope PsychDoc counsels this borrower on the consequences of loan fraud.

If this loan funds, and the borrower did photoshop those paystubs :(

I did not see the CB posts, certainly some troubling stuff there.

That said, the credit numbers are not 'fake' and and from a pure credit detail standpoint this loan was likely to fund anyway.

I do hope Prosper does the added validation, which it seems they do on nearly every loan now.

I believe this listing is a good example of why it's not a good idea to follow the lead of a lender or group leader, without doing due diligence on our own.

Borrowers aren't piling into the loan based on their own due diligence, IMO. They are doing it because they assume that the borrower must be ok, since the group leader and other well-known lenders are bidding.


The borrower tells us to read their CB posts. In those posts are at least two admissions of tax fraud, and several references to faking income verification documents. I'm guessing that not one of the bidders on this loan took the time to read any of those posts on CB.

As they say on MotleyFool.com - Fool On!

I agree alan, my point only being that the credit details alone brought in a lot of bidders.

I don't believe Prosper imagined 100 amateur detectives looking for skeletons in the closet of every borrower. Of course the personal details in the listing and profile can make or break a listing, but if the DTI is not really as it appears in the listing, Prosper should be catching that during any review.

Sigh, let me reply to all this.

First, I just started this job on the 25th. Don't ask me why the pay period starts on the day I started. I wasn't in charge of payroll when this system was implemented and I don't what the heck that is all about. Suffice it to say the payroll system was pretty screwed before I came. I am working on fixing it though and subsequent paystubs will be perfect.

Second, Yes, I did work for my father while I was in school and I did not claim all that I make. It was bad and I know that. I explained why I did it in the thread. However, once I graduated I did find a job with said company and the taxes are taken out automatically so I have to claim everything now.

Third, I requested that I receive pay stubs because of the hard time I was having with proving my income from my two previous jobs. It is an uncommon practice but that is what I wanted.

Fourth, I don't even know how to use Photoshop. I can set up and entire computer but I can't use a lot of the programs :rolleyes:.

About the making up tax forms, a girl I worked with at my previous previous job (before I worked with my dad) did this exact thing. She was telling everyone who wanted to buy a house to do the same. She subsequently was found out and she is in a world of trouble now. I wouldn't do this because I am not stupid.

It would not make sense for me to encourage everyone to go to Creditboards and look me up if I had things to hide there. If that was the case, I would have never put my CB name in my profile in the first place. I did it because I have nothing to hide. And no one posted the links to the thread that confirms what I have been saying on here: Link. What would be the point of making that thread and asking all those questions? Just so I could fool everyone on Prosper into giving me a loan? Riiigggghhhhhhtttt........ Again, if I wanted to scam everyone, I wouldn't have put my life on display for everyone to see via my creditboards postings (there is a lot of personal info on there)

I completely agree that there are a lot of strange circumstances surrounding me and my listing but I assure you I am on the up and up. I know I am not dealing with idiots here. Why would I post fake stuff for all to see if I knew that it could easily be found out? That makes no sense!

I am confidant that I will pass any validation. If anyone decides not to bid, that's OK! For all that have bid or decide to bid, thank you so much.

-Lauren.

Just for the record, I get paid weekly and I make well over 70K a year.

So it is possible.

Our payroll clerk goes nuts paying over 350 people every week.

...Gulp

I don't think you realize how absolutely foolish it is to admit to tax fraud on the internet, using your real name. Especially considering that you previously worked in a profession that derives a majority of wages from tips.

You are not only exposing yourself to an IRS audit, but you are hurting the credibility of your group on Prosper.

Hopefully, PsychDoc will make a public comment about this situation. Lenders don't like to know that a group's borrowers are tax cheats. If it's easy for you to lie to the IRS, how difficult would it be for you to lie to Prosper lenders?

As for the paystubs: There is no company in your area that uses the name on your paystub. If it is a legitimate company, it is not registered in the state of Virginia, the D.C. or the state of Maryland using that name. Does that also mean that your employer doesn't pay taxes?

That fact, combined with the fact that the date on the paystub is incorrect, the fact that the paystub ends in the middle of the week, and that the paystub looks to have been made using WordPerfect, makes your claims seem even less credible.

I don't know what my employer does for taxes, I am not the accountant. Maybe they don't pay taxes, maybe the company name is only a DBA, maybe the company is just a front for drug lords, I have no idea. I am new to the company and I don't have a lot of information. I do know that they pay me and that's all I care about!

If you do not want to bid that is perfectly fine with me but please stop attacking my credibility. If I wanted to scam the lenders of Prosper, I wouldn't have put all that info out there for all to see. I knew questions would come up and that's why I have been on these boards as much as possible and have answered every question that has been asked. If I was scamming, I probably would have just stopped responding by now.


Again, thanks to EVERYONE who has bid on my listing.

PS, I am filing ammended returns for the past 2 years claiming everything that I made. I do plan on paying the taxes I owe, I just couldn't afford to do it while I was in school. I'm working with a CPA right now to get this done. I always pay my debts!

No one is attacking your credibility. I am simply pointing out that you posted a document that doesn't appear to be legitimate, for many reasons.

A DBA would show up in the state's records. There would be a fictitous name record on file, at a minimum.

If that company does exist, I suggest that you forward the address and phone number to PsychDoc, so he can verify it for lenders.

As it stands now, you have posted a paystub from a company that doesn't appear to be a legal entity, and claimed that it accurately represents the wages you make. If that turns out not to be true, you are hurting the credibility of PsychDoc's group and CreditBoards.com.

I just read this thread in its entirety. I concur with the comments made by other Creditboards members on that board to Laurenleigh regarding how foolish, dangerous, and illegal it is to fail to report income for tax purposes. I also concur with Alan and others that the mid-week paystub (its format and content) begs troubling questions.

I have explained myself to cusip who asked for verificatin before. If yu want more info, contact him and he can share with you what I gave him. I can not help what my company does. They are a very private company and have a lot of rules regarding privacy and confidentiality. They will not verify employment over the phone.

So for the last time, if you don't trust me and you do not want to bid, that is ok with me. I've done all I can do at this point and anyone who is not satisfied does not have to bid. I seem to have a lot of people who do trust me as I am already at 92% and the number has gone up even after your "discovery". I'm sure I can pass any after-funding verification.

I am not trying to hurt Creditboards or PsychDoc's group and if he decides that he does not want me to be a part of the group anymore because of all this confusion then so be it.

And I keep forgetting to add:

I started on the 25th and that's why my pay period starts that day. The pay period ends on the day before we get paid. (The 1st and the 15th). It is not really a good way to do it and I am working on fixing that in the system. I was not in control of how payroll was done before I got there. It was convoluted and mistake prone and that is reflected in the paystub in question. These are things that are out of my control!

Thanks once more for the due diligence alan. So many listings to avoid, so little time.

-arebelspy

Don't make me re=read this entire thread.

Thought she said she was being paid weekly and just now said the 1st and 15th.

I've never had a private conversation with PsychDoc, but I do know that he's intelligent enough to understand my motives on these boards. I'm sure other CB members are clued into this, too.

You're going to get funded, obviously.

Only you know the real truth about your employment verification. If I had to guess, I think you're probably a little worried about the information that was posted here. Because of that, I don't think you will ever miss a payment on your Prosper loan.

As I have said in the past, I seldom waste my vetting time on borrowers who, IMO, aren't worth funding.

There is no such thing as bad publicity... just ask ThePurpleCEO :)

It's all water under the bridge.

She's not going to miss a payment on this loan :)

Just to clarify, I don't have any magical vetting. Nor do I fully endorse this listing. I did the same searches as everyone above and came up blanks for the company - which in this day and age should be nearly impossible and is a large red flag.

However, I believe her that she is getting paid somehow, and does intend to use the funds for to help with a house purchase down the road, and I think there is a reasonable enough chance that this loan will be paid back - as she has no defaults, let alone any delinquencies eith her other credit.

I do think some of the details are highly suspicious, and there may be 'cleaner' listings to bid on, but I have bid on it and would not retract at this point if allowed. The bottom line is do I think it will be paid back, and given the credit history I believe it will.